Lazy British workers

[Shadow]

As 300 workers in Teeside and 1200 in Scunthorpe are about to lose their jobs Ratan Tata had some observations to make about British managers.

Unavailability,unwillingness to go the extra mile and complacency are amongst the accusations levelled.

So how do people feel about this?Is he right?

I'd say-based on what I have seen and granted Im talking about the public sector rather than the private-that he is.

Try getting hold of any manager in the NHS on a weekend.

In fact-try getting hold of any senior doctor for that matter.

Frontline staff are there all hours often working on a TOIL basis-without their willingness to put themselves out-go that extra mile,cover each others shifts if necessary,with no glory or extra pay-just knowing they are doing the right thing-I think the NHS would collapse without them.

As I said-I cant comment on the private sector -but if its managers are anything like their private sector counterparts maybe some of them need to get their fingers out

[Banshee]

In my experience- the people that rise to management from front line workers are those who have been the most assertive, and those able to challenge policy and work based rules, and are the ones who get noticed, then when they get their promotion, they become more complacent and fall into line with senior managers . They find themselves less able to challenge, as the management team is a much smaller team. Therefore much 'tighter' and a person's former assertiveness is seen as 'trouble'. So they quickly learn that they have to 'fall into line' or risk alienating themselves from the rest of the team.
Unfortunately it is easier to be the rebel in a larger pool, than it is in a smaller (and higher status) pool.
Its actually the reason that I dont put myself forward for opportunities, coz I know I can sound off, and voice my objections to things as a front line worker, (and I do object to many things) but as a manager, I would be more constricted and have to watch what I say or do.

[Shadow]

I agree with you Bansh as regards workers promoted within a service-it is difficult to challenge but its not impossible-however life can made very difficult for you if you rock the boat as I found out when I did it-ended up looking for work elsewhere because higher management did have the advantage.

But that doesnt explain why some managers seem to be rigid about their own hours whilst expecting others to be flexible about theirs,let alone expecting staff to undertake ridiculous requests whilst not doing things themselves and showing how it should be done.

This can be a major problem with managers who havent been promoted from within but have arrived from elsewhere.When I was working for the NHS one of our directors was an ex-accountant who had no idea about support work.Some of the demands he made of staff were at best laughable and at worst downright dangerous

[Banshee]

I think people should be promoted from within, from the front line. Too often we get managers appointed from totally different fields of work and no idea how the front line works.

[Ann1]

Yes I agree bansh. My daughter "worked her way up" from "worker" to management, and I know she never asks anyone to do anything she's not willing to do herself. She's also very good with time off for kids, shuffling rotas to accommodate when she can etc. All managers should be promoted from within, preferably someone who has worked "at the bottom". I know the Fire Service does this, my ex started out as fireman, and ended up as a divisional officer. Chief Officers were also firemen. I think the police used to do the same, till they stared that "fast track" malarky!!